♪ francine: paolo scaroni is one of the most prominent businessmen. he has been chief executive of but itnt eni and enel, is not just industry and banking. he recently took over as president of a.c. milan, one of the world's most recognized football club. today on "leaders with lacqua," we meet paolo scaroni. thank you for joining us. is the business of football different to energy and banking

because of the emotions of the fans? paolo: it is different. emotions play a big role in football. the fans want your team to win always and don't care very much about your economic results. discrepancy a between the expectation of the fans and the expectation of the shareholders. francine: one player who will play for one of your rivals, does it mean a tying football is back? paolo: i think so. i really think so. italian football has been losing ground in the last 10 years. the best example is that italy did not play in the world cup for the first time since 50 years or even more. , to have a prestigious hedge fund buying the line will make a difference.

paolo: are they looking to find an owner and sell it? are they looking to find an owner and sell it? paolo: my guess is that since it is a hedge fund, one day they will dispose of milan to a buyer and looking to make a profit. francine: does a.c. milan need a signing of from the aldo to be back in business? paolo: we are kind of back in business. we have one player who is playing with us. player,: he is a great don't get me wrong. do you think there will be more positions. paolo: this year, no. we made 4-5 major acquisitions. there is no doubt that the team of milan is stronger and younger

than last year and we are happy to have this team now. we are happy to have maldini, a legend, so he is set to bring back milan where it should have been. francine: football, it's getting players to work together, the team. what is the manager's role, and what is the president's role? paolo: there are several figures on the football team. there is the company, with the chairman of executive of the board, and the chairman of the board. for the time being, i am also the chief executive. for a few weeks more, probably yes. then we have the people who take players, in this case maldini. they have been the leaders of the campaign for the new players in the last six weeks. then there is the trainer, the

trainer of the team, which in our case is -- we can say that today that milan , all of us we have been for many years, and this is a positive thing. francine: are there parallels between how a team plays and how an industry group, listed company, performs? what is the secret? paolo: let me say one thing first. there are people much more expert than me in football. they say the same thing. the matches won by the team, but the tournament is won by the cannot have aou long-term strategy if you don't have behind you a strong company. we have built a strong milan from my financial and organizational point of view, and in this respect is similar to a company, not to eni or enel

, but a real company. francine: what happened to the chinese owner? do you follow that? paolo: i don't follow that. for me, it is a mystery. they are gone. they have disappeared. i don't know what they are doing now. certainly they lost a lot of money in this one year venture with milan. francine: but milan is financially sound? paolo: financially sound, no problem at all. we are moving ahead with a good balance sheet. we will comply with the financial fairplay rules, but everything is from that point of view. francine: do you think italy is free of match fixing in football? paolo: i think so. i have not heard about it in the last few years. francine: what is your biggest hope for a.c. milan? that it becomes the top four?

paolo: it has to go back to the champions league in the long term. we are not expecting a quick fix in this business, but longer-term, milan has to be one of the big players in europe. francine: you have always loved football right? what attracted you to football again? paolo: my story is long. when i was in the u.k., chief executive, i was at the same time chairman of the football club. francine: which is where you were born? paolo: which at that time was and theya u.k. plc, asked me to be chairman of the team. from that moment, i stopped to be just a fan, but became an actor in this business of football. this is probably the reason why i was chosen as the chairman of milan. francine: if there is a buyer that wanted to buy a.c. milan,

what did they misunderstand about attain football? paolo: attain football is cymer to football played in germany or the u.k. or france. to football played in germany or the u.k. or france. players. you have to have tv rights. it is the same thing at the end of the day. francine: how much do care about tv rights? paolo: what i discover about football, it would be the final championship,n manchester united against real madrid. you would have 350 million europeans watching tv. almost nothing else attracts 350 million people to tv. footballero have a past or knew that you would love to hire or play football? these playersmes

like myself, kind of small guys who never let me see any bawls. these kinds of players. francine: up next to, from football to energy, we talk how the oil industry has changed and what is next with paolo scaroni, who led some of the biggest attain energy companies. ♪ ♪

♪ the energy industry has undergone huge changes over the past decade. governments and business increasingly turned green in the face of climate change. but how are companies managing the change, and what with the

next decade look like? paolo scaroni was the chief executive at the italian oil giant eni and enel. at enel, he created a separate wind energy unit for the company. how did you get into the energy industry? that time i wasm living in the u.k., and one day through the italian ambassador in london, i have been contacted by berlusconi, who was that time for minister, and he proposed to .e to join enel he was looking for an international manager, time, so i joined enel. francine: did you meet him and speak about it? paolo: yes, i met him in the embassy first. a few months later, he gave me a meeting in rome, a saturday, if i remember, made me the

proposal. francine: what was he like? paolo: well, he was in very good shape. of, he had been hiring managers all his life, so he had the attitude not of the political man, but of the entrepreneur who was looking for a manager for his company. francine: when you look at the energy space and the energy industry, do you think investors under or overestimate the change of pace? paolo: let's say investors are not looking to what happens in the next three or five years. when you look ahead, the real question is when renewables would take the place of oil. this is a question which is still under discussion. everyone has his own views on it. francine: do you think it will take longer than people expect it to? paolo: no, i say as long as at

for aime i am looking place where i can plug in my iphone, which happens even today, as long as this happens, the time of the industry is not finished. my view, as i said this to the students of john hopkins university last year, when you are iphone will last a couple of weeks, the battery, then you should short oil stocks, not before. francine: that could take 10 to 15 years? paolo: nobody knows because we need to replace the batteries. the lithium batteries, which had been invented in the 1980's, a kind of old technology, which uses cobalt, which is another problem for several reasons, with the new technology that makes the battery light or, last or last- lighter

longer. until we are there come we are not at the time where renewables will replace oil. worry about you underinvestment in the oil industry in preparation for renewables and what that would do to the price of oil? paolo: that is the issue. today, we have an oil price, and i think this will stay as it is for the next three or four years. every time the oil price moves up, shale oil in america will act as a kind of seething, so $70 to $75 a barrel will be the price for a few years, then the lack of investment might push prices higher, even in the , probably$90 or $100 three or four years, and less investment except again, and you have all this unknown. francine: i remember chasing you

around the world trying to get a comment 20 years ago when i used to cover opec. at the time, did you think it would change so quickly? did we underestimate the force that shale producers in the u.s. have become? paolo: certainly everyone underestimated the force and the volumes of shale oil. now i have been reading that shale oil might pick up to 10 million barrels a day, so 10% of world production can come from shale oil. this has been such a threat to the industry that we achieved to results -- to bring results. first, an alliance between saudi arabia and russia, which was unknown and unexpected. even within opec, there is a group scared, so opec, which not discipline, this

time has been disciplined and reduced production by 2 million barrels a day, which has been a major force to move prices $60 from $300 to 18 months ago. byncine: you were surprised this business friendship between saudi arabia and russia to keep control over oil prices. paolo: fear is very important. fear of this unknown element of shale oil has been the trigger for having russia and saudi arabia getting together. francine: the oil industry has tricky politics, right? you have different factions, different politicians, different risky parts of the world. do you love your job? paolo: i love my job. it is a fascinating job, a mixture between this and foreign policy, which i find fascinating. francine: you have the

friendship of the russian order on the same day, would you ever go into politics? paolo: no, i don't think so. bya matter of fact, politics an oil man does not have much to do with the foreign affairs minister. we use bilateral approaches. in foreign affairs, it is a multilateral thing. one countryon takes and its impact on other countries as well. at the end of the day, we are always talking about money in the oil industry. why are foreign affairs minister is talking about other things doesn't matter. next to, what kind of management style does it take andransform companies industries as different as banking and football? more with paolo scaroni next. ♪

♪ paolo scaroni knows a thing or two about leadership. after running two of the biggest companies in italy, he's in charge of one of the countries most popular football club, a.c. milan. he brings that experienced to columbia business school, where he sits on the board, but what kind of leadership does it take to succeed in fields as different as energy and football them and what will happen to italian politics? paolo scaroni is still with me. let's talk about italy's future. what were the relationship be between europe and italy five years from now? paolo: that is the most difficult question you have asked me. this will depend from italy and europe as well. europe should become charming sum of rulesst the

to be applied to the countries. if europe he comes more charming , more appealing, more popular, then italy will come and other countries as well, will become closer to europe. francine: is this europe reforming itself, or is this politicians around the world making the case for the benefits of being in the eu? paolo: no, you see, the point of me is that by a choice national government, we have built a europe which is not politically attractive. i was asking the other day to a friend of mine, tell me who was the predecessor of mr. juncker? i don't remember. he has been the president of europe for 10 years. i don't remember.

mr. -- gone, forgotten. blair, ieveryone mr. don't know, so what does it mean that we have built a europe which was not popular to the people? was a kind of technocratic mechanism. ?here they manage a lot of money. rules,n find countries, so maybe power, yes, but not europe which speaks to the people. francine: does that mean you will either have a more integrated europe, or it will break apart? paolo: i don't think it will break apart. every day we have examples of what happens if you are outside major economic zones. look at what happens to turkey now. instead of the lira, the

euro. the whole story would be different. i am convinced the eurozone and europe will stay. the point is how do we make europe more attractive to the europeans? francine: what does it mean being a european politician, a european leader, in 2018? how do you have to communicate differently with your citizens? much more is difficult because people are very skeptical. not just in italy, but everywhere. politicians are not popular in every country in europe. even if they are popular, they are not popular for longer. look at what happened in mr. macron for example. to communicate is not easy at all and you have to find new rules to communicate. francine: what is your leadership style? paolo: you should ask the people working with me. it is not easy to judge one's

own style. or threeive you two pieces of advice. the first one, which i have been trying to apply all my career, is to motivate people. i tell you how i see business. decisions are pretty easy. you don't need to be an intellectual to run a company. the what you need is people doing what you want them to do. people do what they want you them to do only if they are motivated. the first task of the chief executive is to motivate the people. this is key. francine: but how? , financial incentives financialn -- incentives, inspiration? francine: the only thing that is collected is to care. people want to be cared of.

and they understand in one second if you care, or if you don't care, then some people want to be motivated through, you tell them they are good, you tell them, you challenge them. everyone is motivated, but you have to care. that is my first advice. francine: number two? paolo: a chief executive should e himself to do nothing, to be free, to think, to motivate people, to be free to look for mistakes. and you have always to be relaxed, relaxed. francine: not micromanage? paolo: not micromanage. to organize it in such a way that everyone works and you look at them, control them, but you don't do much. every time i met in my life people truly important, i always

met people who were relaxed, smiling, giving you the impression they had nothing to do. i have never seen people rushed if they are really important. francine: chief executives or politicians? paolo: chief executives and politicians as well, because you have to be organized. that is super important thing. that is the way i look at it. francine: number three? paolo: you should not stay too long in the same job. you have to change your job maximum every seven or eight years. the reason to do it that is all, after at of while you do not have any more fresh ideas. second, even if you have a good idea, it is not easy for you to promote it. third, even if you are very convinced to deny what you have been telling for you --

and forth, you start to become accustomed to your people you don't see anymore. and therefore, you do not change them anymore. in total, who once a chief executive who does not have fresh ideas. ? he cannot deny what he has been doing in the past. thirdly, cannot change people to make people really as they should be. it is not going to be a good chief executive. so you have to change. something youhere would have done differently in your career with hindsight? one thing? paolo: one thing i would have been doing differently in my ,areer, probably i should have i should have not stayed in italy for very long. i lived in italy during 20 years, and then i came to the u.k.

probably i should have come earlier than that. it has been for me a fantastic experience. francine: paolo scaroni, thank you so much for joining us. ♪

rishaad: asia benchmark declining for a sixth session. a little more optimism creeping into hong kong and china markets about the emerging-market. -- none ofselloff the selloff since 2008 has inflicted so much pain. president trump says he has completed his trade talks with china. canada is still talking. i'm rishaad salamat. haidi: i am haidi stroud. silicon valley is in the spotlight.

>> i am at the forum in singapore. we will talk turkey and asia, and how women are making their mark. this is bloomberg. ♪ haidi: it continues to be the story of the emerging-market selloff. equities, we get the msci emerging markets teetering on the edge of their territory. on the other hand, we are getting closer to the tariffs on $200 billion of chinese goods. we can't discount the reports of more chaos in the white house. rishaad: indeed, that continues at the moment with this op-ed in "the